Scared of people who are scared...

Hello everyone,

here I am again with the scaredy-pup. As some of you may remember, I posted a while ago that my now almost 9 moth old male sometimes reacts to people with fearful-agressive barking and I had no idea what sets him off.

Well, on the upside, I think I have figured out the trigger - it is people who are wary or scared of him. He has absolutely no issue with people who are confindent and at ease around him and will let them approach and pet him with no problem. But when someone tenses up and stares at him like a rabbit at a snake (as scared people will do) he becomes worried.

I usually keep him out of the way when I see someone who is obviously uncomfortable, but in some people this is very subtle and sometimes these people even make a point of approaching anyway and asking "does he bite?"

Needless to say, his reaction (WOOF, WOOF) does not help their attitude. I'm not sure how to handle this - when I realise they are tense I redirect or just leave, but when people act confident although they are not, Monkey is usually quicker to figure it out than I am. I'd like him to realise that scared people are just scared and not a threat - but I cannot very well say "would you mind not being scared of my dog for a minute so I can train him not to bark at you". Does anyone have experience with this?

ta ta, me and my monkey

[jesterjenn]

I don't have any experience of this, but I would ask them to stop staring at the dog as this in the dog world is a threatening behaviour (hence his reaction).

Just ask them to not look at him and it should help him with your training him out of it Once they've stopped looking at him, get him to "watch" (look up adoringly at you as our trainer puts it lol) and then treat him for looking at you That's what I would do anyway

[Stuart]

This is not uncommon at all,.. I have to be a little careful with Kee over this, she loves people [ they all do ],.. but twice in the early days, on different days, with different children, she has tried to snap at a child, both of them asked if they could pet her,..I said yes, [Kee was on lead both times],.. both children did the same thing, in that they both put out their hands to pet her, and as Kee turned to look at them, both withdrew their hands,.. and tried again, but kept shying away,.. and Kee then tried to snap

It has not happened for a long time, but I have been very carefull and told the child what to expect from Kee,..i.e. said something like,.. `she will lick your hand` or something like that so they are expecting her head to turn towards them, once they know that they dont shy off so much.

There is no such problems with confident children

Its difficult to know what to do if people just look at the dog, I am not sure if asking people not to look is going to do a lot of good, when ever I have had people look at mine I usualy just talk to the dogs,... but Jen is right,..eye contact is a threat, especialy as the dog will sense that the person probably doesnt trust them or is wary of them,.... or even openly dislikes them

[kita]

Originally Posted by Stuart

both children did the same thing, in that they both put out their hands to pet her, and as Kee turned to look at them, both withdrew their hands,.. and tried again, but kept shying away,.. and Kee then tried to snap

With my Anatolian I (with the help of my training friend) taught him that if anyone withdrew their arms quickly, or pulled their hands up to their chests as people do in fear, he instantly went into a 'down'. We used clicker training as it is a much faster way to tell the dog it has behaved correctly. Initially she would put her hands/arms on her chest and I would tell him down, gradually we withdrew the actual command from me and he would just go into a down as soon as her hands went up and onto her chest.

It really paid off one day when a group of children were around him - one was a bit scared of him and his size and pulled her hands away when he turned his head towards her - he instantly went into a down and she relaxed. None of the kids realised that they had given him a 'command' so it avoided them 'teasing' him with it in future when they saw us.

You could do the same thing when people look directly at a dog, but instead teach the dog to look at you, initially use a command and gradually phase it out.

Of course you do need a number of people to train this and it takes a bit of time to do, but it is well worth the effort.

Always remember though - you do have to tell the dog what you require of it, it is no good expecting the dog to read your mind!

When you see people approaching you have to give the dog some idea what you want him to do, tell him 'sit', 'quiet' or 'nicely', I have used 'leave it' but find some people take offense at that one!!!

If you don't give a command and leave the dog to his own devices then he will act how he thinks fit - and if he is scared/uneasy himself that will be lunging around and barking.

Sometimes a head collar can help give the dog more confidence (and you more control), I used to use one when I was walking in town.

Sue

Originally Posted by kita

When you see people approaching you have to give the dog some idea what you want him to do, tell him 'sit', 'quiet' or 'nicely', I have used 'leave it' but find some people take offense at that one!!!

LOL I know what you mean! But I cannot blame them, I do use that for rotten fish carcasses and dog poo!

what you're saying about the command makes sense, I'll try that! He's on a head collar anyway as I don't want to end my life under a bus because of a squirrel...

I guess the problem is that when I ask an already scared person not to look at my dog their reaction tends to be "why, does he bite??" *even more intense stare at dog to detect slightest movement*

I guess I could try desensitizing him to "starers" - it would hve to be someone with good acting skills playing "scared" as approving looks don't seem to bother him.

Just now we had an interesting experience: we were at our local newsagents (where he goes every day) when about 5 people came in at the same time. It is a tiny shop, so Monkey was beginning to feel a bit crowded and gave a teeny, pathtic "wooflet" - I immediately stepped between him and the people and he sat down and was fine til we left

Does he just need me to "protect" him from the evil people? wouldn't that end up with me babying him too much?

[Stuart]

Interesting idea Sue,... I will get onto that one if I can,.. I am not sure if I withdraw my hand in training whether that would then work with a child,... its either that or wait till the grandchildren visit, they will have to pretend though as they are all very confident