Still biting at 15 weeks - HELP!

[Chrystie22]

Thought I'd email you to pick your brains: Diva's biting is not getting any better, she bites us anytime we are trying to do something like putting her harness or collar or leash on, when we pick her up to go up/down stairs, when we are busy preparing food she comes behind and grabs hold of our arms or ankles,...and once she has grabbed hold of the arm, she growls and hangs on quite tight, it's not easy to get her off as she thinks we want to play and bites even harder!
We have a set routine for her for everything, when we take her out to pee or when we are ready to feed her and she responds well to that or to commands, but the biting is a bit too much. We have tried to put fingers through her collar like the trainer at the puppy class showed us last week, she calms down and then either go down or sit when we ask her, and then we reward her but we have to repeat this countless times before she eventually settles. Anyway it is not easy for us to grab hold of her sometimes so she sees this as an invitation to play too...
The only thing that seems to work temporarily is isolating her, but there again the layout of our house doesnt make it easy. We have no door between kitchen and lounge, only an open archway so we cant leave her in the kitchen and 'hide' in the other room as she will follow us. The only place we can put her in is her crate, with us leaving the room; I know you shouldnt use the crate as 'punishment', so we use it as 'time-out' and she seems to see the difference because when we put her in there for the night or when we go out to work we tell her 'bed' and 'down' and treat her, but when we put her in for 'time-out' we take her there silently, tell her 'no', close the door and leave the room for about 5mn.

We know she is a strong character and she is not the only puppy that bites as Ive read or heard so many stories about other similar pups but it is starting to grate a bit and even if we try to remain calm, it's not always easy as we are sort of on tenterhooks waiting for her to bite; my arms are all black and blue and scratched and I dont think I can take much more.

Sorry for the long post.

Any advice?

[LOVEGSD]

With regards to the biting whilst putting her collar etc on, have you tried to treat her as a distraction so she sees this as a good thing that's happening to her? Also maybe she doesn't want to be picked up anymore, some dogs just don't like it?? If she grabs your arm, don't struggle away from her this is part of the game, you need to freeze and avoid eye contact, when she lets go move away from her and ignore her.

I found saying 'Ah ah' or 'No', folding my arms and turning away from Diesel worked the best because he realised all fun stopped and we didn't get anywhere fast.

I think you need to decide on how you want to handle this biting and stick with it, you need to be consistant so that every time she bites she gets the same response....it does get better I promise.

[Chrystie22]

Originally Posted by LOVEGSD

With regards to the biting whilst putting her collar etc on, have you tried to treat her as a distraction so she sees this as a good thing that's happening to her? Also maybe she doesn't want to be picked up anymore, some dogs just don't like it?? If she grabs your arm, don't struggle away from her this is part of the game, you need to freeze and avoid eye contact, when she lets go move away from her and ignore her.

I found saying 'Ah ah' or 'No', folding my arms and turning away from Diesel worked the best because he realised all fun stopped and we didn't get anywhere fast.

I think you need to decide on how you want to handle this biting and stick with it, you need to be consistant so that every time she bites she gets the same response....it does get better I promise.

Thanks for your advice but we are using treats when we are trying to put the collar/ leash or harness on her but she is still struggling and attempting to grab hold of our arms! We need to pick her up unfortunately when we take her up/ down stairs as we dont want to put too much pressure on her joints and her to have health problems later on in life
And about folding our arms and ignoring her, well she goes on to bite our legs or ankles and it REALLY hurts!! My parner is starting to believe what some people have told him that she could become an aggressive dog, especially as she looks that way with the teeth bared/ growling and arched back when she grabs hold of us! I refuse to believe this is the case...

[daeneth]

I find with biting you have to be quick AND consistent.
The second her teeth touch you, no matter how hard, completely over react and either yelp (though I know this can spur some pups on) or tell them no or equivalent command, without a seconds thought you have to isolate her or turn your back and ignore her; like with all puppy training it has to be immediate so they realise this is a repercussion of them biting as opposed to something they start doing a second after the biting is over.

We have an "open plan" house and so we bought a baby gate to make an isolation area for her. Because you say you have tried turning and ignoring her I'd suggest isolation as the immediate reaction.

I've found zero tolerance to teeth on skin the best way to stop it and also to prevent it becoming an issue in the future and don't play with her using your hands else you are passively training her to bite hands.

Dean

[LOVEGSD]

Zero tolerance is an excellent phrase for it! Consistency is the key and whilst you may feel that you aren't getting anywhere one day it will just click, I know it's easy to say when I'm not the one being bitten but we have all been through it.

As for your hubby thinking this will make her aggressive that's ridiculous, she's a puppy and needs to be shown the rights and wrongs and if you don't do it she will always think it's ok to use her mouth.

Don't give up!

[heygirl28]

'Teeth bared/growling/arched back ready to attack' - thats exactly what mine is doing to my husband! He too thinks we've landed ourselves with a 'loony' dog. Desperately hope he's wrong I just keep telling him she's only a pup she needs to be taught right from wrong, must agree with u though, the biting is SO BAD lol! Hope we both get sorted and soon!!

[daeneth]

If you find the aggression being targeted towards the husband more please try get your husband to play a more positive role towards the dog.

I found Okami was much more possessive and aggressive (although still not much) towards me than Tam, but this is largely because Tam had gotten her as a pup in Cornwall and stayed with her parents for a few weeks before bringing her up to live with me; when I tried to go near her food or take a toy she'd growl because she didn't know me or trust me. I spent the next week feeding her at least once a day and this curbed off real quick.

This doesn't mean you aren't to punish the dog (isolate/ignore etc) if the dog is aggressive to him, this is vital to eventually teach the dog manners and what behaviour they are allowed to show any human in general. The purpose of getting him to play a more positive role (feeding, playing) is that firstly you won't get the aggression or possessive issues before she's fully socialised and more importantly that in the long run the dog will listen to the hubby and respect his decision making and commands.

Also make sure you both get involved early on in basic obedience training so the dog can start learning what is expected of them.

Dean.

[Chrystie22]

We are both feeding her, training her, and so on...she bites both of us equally! She is ok on everything else (lets us take her food bowl off her/ responds well to commands,..), it's just the biting is almost constant and this is really annoying. Also she seems to 'moan' at everything, whether she is playing with a toy or has to sit still if we try to clean her after being in the park or if we try taking her in/ out of the car!! She is not in her teenage period yet but she sure sounds like one ; even if she goes down when we ask her, she does it but sometimes just flops down doing this weird sound as if to say: ''okkkayyy then if I really HAVE to!''..it looks comical but we dont let her see us being amused coz we dont want her to see us as weak!
I guess we should get ourselves a baby gate and try the isolating her in the kitchen, see if that works!

[daeneth]

Yeah it sounds like she is mostly playing so you just need to affirm that your arm isn't a fun toy

With regards to the husband taking a more positive role it was more a comment to heygirl28 as she said this was an issue but I understand with you it's pretty consistent for any person.

[Bonniesmummy]

I had this issue too, I think you need to relax more and try not to expect results overnight... It will just click into place I promise. it took weeks with Bonnie but be patient it will pay off. I also think by expecting things to work straight away and when it doesnt trying something else only confuses them ... Be consistent with one method and it Give it a chance to sink in